Trash All IE Hacks 517
Let's admit it, we all hate Internet Explorer 6. About 80% of our CSS debug time are spend on IE6. We all know that IE6 is outdated and has horrible CSS rendering engine. However, most average Internet users haven't realized that yet. Why? Because we put our hard work on it and patch the bugs by various IE hacks. Well, it is time to do something...
Common IE hacks
-
CSS Conditional comments
In order for our sites to work on specific verson of IE (due to improper CSS rendering), CSS conditional comments are used to apply special CSS specifications to fix it. If you haven't realized this yet, read the IE bug articles on positioniseverything.net (warning: you might hate IE more after you read them). -
PNG hack
As mentioned early, IE6 is outdated and doesn't support PNG alpha transparency. In order to display PNG (with alpha transparency) properly in IE6 or older version, we use this hack.Aleksey asked on "Simple Double Quotes":
"Hello Nick. I see some bug.
The Close button ( X ) don’t transparent. Test on IE6 and MyIE."My response:
"Yes, I know the PNGs don't display probably in IE6. But guess what, I'm not going to bother to fix it. I'm sick of hacking IE6 bugs. You should upgrade your browser anyway. Why are you still using the outdated browser?"
Why trash IE6 hacks?
I know this is difficult because about 37% (according to w3schools.com) of internet users are still using IE6. But, together we can make a different. Stop using IE hacks on your sites and let them see the ugly side of IE6. Eventually, they will find a better browser (ie. Firefox) or at least upgrade to newer version of IE.
Update:
Agree with the comments below, the statistic from W3schools does not reflect the entire internet. According to TheCounter.com, the global browser stats of IE6 users is 52% in July 2007.
Support me
If you agree with me, please support Web Designer Wall by making a vote and spreading out the word. Let's trash all IE hacks and code happily ever after...
Loading ...Conclusion
85% voted yes
15% voted no
Here are what people have said:
- "My boss will fire me if my sites don't work in IE6" because 52% of internet users are still using IE6.
- Display a message (in yellow bar), "You are using an outdated browser, please upgrade your browser" to IE6 users.
- If it is a personal project, you can ignore all the IE6 users. But for professional or commercial projects, you can't live without them.
- Avoid using any features (ie. PNG, CSS selectors) that are not supported by IE6.
I think IE 7 and IE 8 ARE worse than IE 6. Microsoft is just not in the same category when it comes to web: it makes our life so painful!
Hmm.. not sure I agree on this.. IE 6.0 is not that bad as people are trying to say it is (as long as we don’t talking about IE 5.5). If you know how all major browsers work and how to handle the CSS properly for them there is no need for hacks. Problems that often occur in IE 6.0 is mainly caused by padding or floats that don’t work properly, but this is easy avoided by adding a fixed height, width or inline on those elements.
There is no need for PNG hacks either, the IE 6.0 supports the 8 bit transparent PNG quite good and if people save their PNG in the 8 bit format instead they save both Kilobyte and they all can delete their PNG hacks. Sadly it is not possible to save transparent 8 bit PNG in Adobe Photoshop so people have to use Adobe Fireworks in that case.
Things that can be more frustrating is the form handling in the different browsers, this is a part that have to be fixed and they should be rendered with the same margin, padding, border, background properties.
I know everybody hate fixing js and css problems for ie6 but i think fact is fact. You cannot ignore ie6 users. So just forget about forcing user to upgrade the browser and get two laptops. One with windows vista (with ie7) and Windows XP as virtual machine. And other pc/laptop you can code your css and js.
Here are the links:
First download http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyID=04d26402-3199-48a3-afa2-2dc0b40a73b6&displaylang=en
than:
http://www.microsoft.com/Downloads/details.aspx?FamilyID=21eabb90-958f-4b64-b5f1-73d0a413c8ef&displaylang=en
Install them and you will get windows XP with ie 6 preinstalled.
Hi there, great idea to count extra bill for fixing bugs of IE6. As you can see my actual site, I missed out to fix it up there, cause it disturbing me too much. I’m using the google fix js for IE – makes transparent png, float, margins paddings and other shit stuff in IE. but not fixing all of them, you must still change some margins and so.
I think, We have to push Microsoft, maybe via court, to make new compilation of IE6 with fixed all bugs against standart compilant browsers and with automatical install in clients computer and replace the old version of IE6.
But it’s just an idea :)
keep smiling and still working on good mood projects
Although I love this idea, I will not ignore IE6 until the usage goes below 10%. We just need to put in the extra effort for the computer illiterate who think the blue ‘e’ stands for Internet…
Absolutely! Trash all things Microsoft that are purposefully generated the way they are because Microsoft ‘thinks’ they know what is best for the PC world… However, for the time being, I have to agree with Scott. Personally, I build for more capable browsers first then open it in IE6 & 7 to see what broke…
Love the site, you will be seeing a lot more of me on here, trust me.
I cannot believe the comments I read. I support old versions if they are largely used like IE6. Your boss is not to blame for knowing a lot of folks out there are using an old browser. Explain a 1000 times but a fact is a fact: if a company has a site that a lot of people cannot see it properly, they lose face. It is ok if you want to do that with your own business, but you cannot expect that same behaviour from anyone else.
And also take notice of what Subi said…not everyone lives in a place with 24 hours of access to high speed internet.
Think of others for once, not only on your convenience.
I don’t complete ignore IE6 but i don’t care mucht about him, if something don’t work 100% on IE6 (ie. a margin displaying wrong on a blockquote) i just live, anyway, the yellow bar (Active X Install style) displaying on top of the page if detect a super idiot user (IE6 users) sound great.
I am taking a middle position.
In general, as of this year, I will no longer be supporting IE6. But that doesn’t mean I will go out of my way to break sites for IE6 either. I just will no longer employ new special IE6 hacks, nor will I test sites in IE6. And if an IE6 hack I already coded gets in the way of creating a new feature or upgrading an existing feature, it will go.
In other words, I am letting IE6 support on old sites degrade on a natural pace that doesn’t make me spend any extra time being concerned about it, and I’m forgetting about IE6 support on new sites.
Hi, i work as IE Engineer at Microsoft. We internally fix a lot of bugs regarding CSS in IE6. We all are very aware that IE6 is outdated. Problem is: Lotsa high cost (read Millions $ for one SAP R3) business applications are written for IE6 and they dont can upgrade so easily. Therefore lotsa big business customers (whole governments) use IE6. Those customers are prio one and nobody literally absolutely nobody at MS cares for some Youtube user writing, hey i like Firefox better. But if a Billion Dollar Company says hey we will use Firefox, then we fix the bugs. There is no way to rewrite IE6 engine. So as a result even internal people are starting to advertising abandoning IE&. E.g. with that yellow color bar you mentioned. I am myself a webdesigner of course and i know that every browser behaves in a different way. You can even go one step further: Tried to view my webpage in KDE/Linux: doh.. everything was off. Especially Typefonts Positions and Positioning of DIVs. So even if IE6 is abandoned there will still be a lot of testing for designers for different platforms in the years to come.
I use IE 6 on a computer running Windows 2000. I have to because the older application software I must use does not run under XP. I would love to upgrade to 7 if I could. Why does Microsoft limit this system to IE 6 on purpose? I will need this system for at least a decade for legacy support. Of course I can use Firefox on it and it works well but Firefox hits websites it does not work on as well. IE always works for me.
WS2000 ist out of support, even out of extended support. Xp will probably be supported some several more years, but no more SPs as afaik. Windows Server 2008 R2 will be the server equivalent to Windows 7, which is 5 ! versions newer than Windows 2000. I suggest you aks the vendor of that ancient application to update its software to latest Windows Versions.
IE6 is garbage because Microsoft was/is egocentric. I completely agree with this article and practice the NON-support of IE6 for the most part.
What many people don’t realize is that IE6 can’t be updated because many networks are fire-walled or outright closed so any update is either impossible or needs IT permission, and we know how that can be in a bureaucratic corporation.
With all the talk about “the facts are facts” let’s talk about the garbage that Microsoft produces, i.e. Office Suite, Server, WINDOWS!, etc. Pretty much every product they make is inferior except that they have big $ clientele and the market/industry is forced to use a product because IBM or some other big rep tech company does so. With the advent of Open Source, we know finally see reasonably priced products that work better… who cares if it doesn’t have a 10,000 feature list… atleast it works!
Lastly, can someone explain to me why MSFT is advertising on TV and the web for IE8? I suppose their ripping off Facebook and company too!
@Gattler: No.
Back to the article, I think that IE should die. Not just IE 6, but ALL OF IE.
Unfortunately a company that could have bought Lehman Brothers in cash won’t die so quickly. IE wont die either. There were internal talks, but since companies are heavily relying on Group Policy Functionality with IE for Domain Controllers and Active Directory and the Zone Model, which is extensive Configurability, MS could even publish an IE9. This could run on Webkit who knows. One thing is sure, for a companies IT department cross application configurability from one source outweighs many loosley organized and unsupported 3rd Party Products out there. That does not mean that IE is not inferior, it simply means MS offers the best overall package for big businesses in terms of service, workshops and documentation. Technet and MSDN is the de facto biggest Tech Documentation i have ever come along.
@Texasguy01 :
why don’t you use IEtab?
I write the font end of web applications used mainly by the local government. I assume their IT guys are scared to upgrade to IE6 in case it causes system problems (otherwise I can’t think why they haven’t, as they likely have legitimate MS licences).
So, nearly all of them use ie6!
But actually, if you write decent css, very little has to be hacked, and the bits that do can be addressed with separate stylesheets.
Mind you, if I see the peekaboo bug again, I will scream!
For many people upgrading IE6 to IE7 is not an option, because IE7′s user interface is completely different from IE6. (For example one does not have the normal control over all the toolbars in IE7).
IE7 looks and feels like a completely different browser instead of an upgrade.
So IE6 hacks should be used, and thought of as supporting a completely different browser.
37% still using IE 6? We can’t just ignore 37%.
If the figure had been 5 or 10% then maybe…. but not for 37%
Keith D
The best solution would be for Microsoft to just stop making an internet browser altogether, just stop, you can’t do it right, don’t do it. Ship your crappy operating systems with another browser.